Below are various comments & questions asked by readers of this site.
(Going back to those sent in Oct 2005 only)

If you would like to add a comment or ask a question, please feel free.

Send comments to

 

Dear Sir,
I have just found your website on the above. I was at the site called "Reports". In the first paragraph you refer
to G E Buckmaster. I am one of his great grandsons. I have seen his police record. He was No 120 in the force
and was paid a reward of 5 pounds for being in on the capture of Morgan and was fined 5 pounds for bashing
a prisoner, amongst other things. I am digging out his stuff. I have a long way to go.

Regards

Desmond K O'Toole
Rous Mill
NSW

 

Hello Desmond,
that is the great part of having a site......hearing from people such as yourself..............
hope to hear more from you soon. Dave.
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G'day Dave,
My name is Steve Jager and I am an fan of your site and work about the Kelly Gang. I firstly want to thank you
for the personal time and effort you have put into your site to make people aware of the TRUE FACTS regarding
the final stand and the history of this nation that I believe does not adapt its history like it should. Your site helps
that sad fact.
I myself have had a fascination with Ned and the boys since around the age of 4 or 5 when I would look at the
photos and etchings of the gang in Harry Nunn's Pictorial History of Bushranger's. Even before I could read, the
pictures helped tell me the story, and the fascination grew as I learnt to read. I'm now 24 and I have worked at the
Old Melbourne Gaol when I was a teenager on a volunteer basis just so I could share Ned's side of the story with
the tourists. I have a grand collection of Kelly memoribillia and I am now collecting publications for research for my
own book/s in the future based on a definative history that hopefully people can remember and share with future
generations. I do have quite a thorough knowledge of the boys, the ballads and the stories of the gang but new info
is always popping up as you yourself have seen at the Glenrowan dig. The thing is some of the information I find,
and the questions I ask, I find I dont have anyone who knows ANYTHING about the Kelly's to compare....... if you
get my drift. If I may give you an example. My missus Nan married into the Kirwan family, Lawrence Kirwan being
the police spy "Renwick" of Carboor (I didnt find this out until a year after me and the missus being together). Well
every 2 years the Kirwan family have a family reunion and January just passed I met the family member who does
the family tree and she sent me down facsmile's of the Lawrence Kirwan papers relating to his refused claim from
the reward board including letters written by Hare and Sadlier stating why he shouldnt be paid for his duties.
I know you might not be interested in that specific information for your site is mainly based on the final stand, but
was hoping you could put me in touch with ANYONE who might be interested in this information or even a general
chat about the gang. I was also wondering if you could tell me when the dig finishes up?

thanks for your time

from Steve Jager


There must be a lot of us really keen on the Kelly story!
If anyone wishes to contact Steve please contact me and I will pass you on . Dave.

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Hi there

Not too sure whether you can help me or not - but ............................... family legend has it that one of my husbands
descendants was the blacksmith who made Kellys Armour - I know you hear this everyday!! I am not completely
blinded by this possibility - however I would like to get to the bottom of this rumour/fact kept alive by the family.
If it is not true then I would like to give the family good reason why they should just let it go!!

However - if it is true.............................

I have read your site and I am well aware that you cannot publicly say who was the 'smiffy' who did make the armour -
but if I give you what I know - could you at least say - "long way off!" or "just maybe!"?

Here goes


The 'man' alledged to be related is Charles Cartwright WRIGHT - he married widow Maria WATKINS in Cue Western
Australia in 1896 and died in Cue Nov 1911, I belive he was a Miner in this area for some time -

I know it is not much to go on - but I just cant seem to find out too much about him I am afraid. Short of buying a Death
Certificate (which I had not considered doing as he has married into the family after the death of one of my ancestors)
I not too sure what else to tell you.

I understand and appreciate the "Blacksmiths" need for privacy - but would like to hear from you non the less


Kind regards


Virginia HILLS

Thank you Virginia,
the story of who made the armour is a fascinating one indeed.
We can never be sure exactly who was involved. (we do have a pretty good idea though)
West Australia seems to be a popular destination for those associated with the Kelly story in one way or another.

Dave.
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Dave, had a question for you. I have seen in past articles references to Ned Kelly's step father George King.
I have also seen past auctions that present sets of horns that are scrimshawed (attributed to King) with images
of Kelly and gang.
I have recently come across such a piece. Do you know additional information regarding items like these?
I am thinking of sending them to auction somewhere.
I have images if you would like to see. Frank

Somehow I cannot see George King working away on these horns.:)
The 2003 auction price was $192,000 but the price of such items plummeted after a woman reported paying $10 for hers.
 Dave

.......................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Hey, great website! I have been studying the Kelly Gang for a couple of years now and it's good to see that the younger
generation can gain easy access to all things Kelly via your site. Thanks for the photos of what's happening at Glenrowan,
glad I had the opportunity to see the siege sight before it had been altered so much.

Keep up the good work! Regards, Ross. Bargara, Qld.

Thanks Ross, will keep at it. Dave.

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I noted from your website that R.Steele is looking for information about the family of Sgt. Arthur Steele.
I am 'loosely' related to his grandson, the late Arthur Loftus Maule Steele through the family of my late mother.
I would be happy to try and fill in some gaps if he/she is interested.
Although I grew up in Melbourne, through a series of events I came to live in Wangaratta in 1990 and I am actually
the current Mayor of this wonderful Rural City of Wangaratta. Uncle Arthur Steele and and his sister Aunt Florence
were well known to me.
regards
Roberto Paino
January 2008

Message passed on. Dave.

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Hi Dave,
Your site has been very helpful in providing information on the history of Glenrowan. My family and I passed through
Glenrowan on Friday 21st September. We happened upon a gathering at Lions Park regarding the revitalisation
project, so we stayed, joined the locals and dignitaries and listened to Peter Batchelor's speech and subsequent
plaque unveiling. The news story "Glenrowan glowin'" (by Brad Worrall-The Border Mail, 21st September 2007)
correctly mentioned a train noisily hurtling by, gunshots sounds from the Kelly museum and a siren wailing- very surreal!

Well I can add something to that, the mood of some locals after the speech. One lady in particular was not hesitant in
stating what she thought derisively of the dignitaries, works and results of the revitalisation project. I wouldn't be surprised
if she was descended from the Kelly clan herself! I(I hasten to add that she wasn't directly yelling at them , there was no
scenes, she was just speaking her mind). I cannot recall much of what she said, but there was something about bus drivers
finding it very difficult to turn on the main street due to the new roadworks- have you heard something of that?

Following our visit to the town, and having stumbled upon the latest Glenrowan "chapter" by chance, I needed to know more.
Your site has provided the detailed information I was missing -so thankyou.
Here is a close up pic of the plaque if you are interested.

signa.jpg (135965 bytes)

Jeremy Price
Berwick


G'day Jeremy,

you are right about the local's comments, they are not happy with the way traffic has been changed. 
I can also tell you that they are none too happy about the size of the street lights. They are far too big for a little street. 
The time it took for the works in Gladstone St has also been an issue.  
I am glad to know that my site has been of some assistance to you and that it may continue to do so in the future too.
I appreciate the image of the plaque, thanks for sending it in for all to see.
Regards Dave White

...................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Hi Dave, Couldn't help but notice the Border Mail's story on your site regarding the theft of the plaque that commemorated the three police who lost their lives in a shootout at Stringybark Creek whilst in pursuit of two young men, namely Ned Kelly and his young brother Dan. The two young men were being hunted by police for the alleged attempted murder of a police officer of questionable repute. Like most genuine enthusiasts of the Kelly saga, a lot of us believe that the Kelly family were victimised by the police to such an extent it was the main reason for the Kelly outbreak. The sole police survivor of the shootout, Thomas McIntyre, is claimed to have told Ned he was aware as were other police of how he had been wronged. As the Kelly outbreak progressed, many innocent men were gaoled by police because they were simply acquaintances or relatives of the Kelly family. They were accused of a crime without one piece of evidence. Now back to the plaque stolen at Stringybark. The two police interviewed by the Border Mail have stated they suspect whoever stole it could be crooks who still sympathise with the Kelly family or idolise Ned Kelly. Sounds familiar doesn't it! Maybe a lot of us do sympathise with the Kelly family and all those poor buggers that got caught up in the whole sorry mess. Maybe in some strange way some of us do idolise Ned Kelly after reading his story, but it doesn't make us the prime suspects for a low pathetic and disgusting act. What would the public think if we thought the plaque was stolen by a police officer or an ex police officer as a souvenir in remembrance of fallen comrades? I said a quiet prayer up at Stringybark Creek for those three brave police who lost their lives. I said a prayer at Mansfield for those three brave police who lost their lives, but I bet I wasn't the only Kelly enthusiast who had said a quiet prayer for them. All I'm trying to say is don't jump to conclusions and tar us all with the same brush. Whoever stole that plaque are the same people who would steal your car or anything else they can get their hands on and not think twice about it. They are the people we Kelly enthusiast would love to get our hands on. It also states in the paper that Rangers are investigating the theft. I thought that this would be a job for the police?
Alan Crichton


Pic by Alan Crichton.

Well said Alan! Dave.

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Hi Dave,

Through you I wanted to thank Alan Crichton for his report about the Beechworth Ned Kelly Weekend. 
It was a lovely write-up and many thanks Alan for your comments about my talk - next time I will allow 
you to carry the box of Kellyana ... but I'll be right behind you all the way to my car!!!

Dave, appreciate the work and dedication you've put into www.glenrowan1880.com and I'm very pleased to 
see you are publishing Alan's new novel Far Beyond the Falls in instalments. You and I are among a 
handful of people who have read the novel and I agree totally with your comments - it's a fantastic read. 
Thank you to both you and Alan for making it available to your readers - I know they will enjoy it as much 
as I did.

Cheers,

Brian McDonald

Hello Brian,
yes I am very fortunate to have Alan adding value to 1880!
His write up about the Beechworth weekend was great for those who did not make it.
Alan mentioned he had offered to carry those priceless books of yours back to the PT,
I think he had as much chance of that as I did when I offered to carry Joe Byrne's helmet
for Rupert Hammond.lol

1880 has always been a labour of love for me and is made all the more worthwhile when 
people such as yourself make favourable comments about it. I am sure everyone who reads Alan's book
will enjoy it heaps and hopefully when he publishes it in hard copy will seek out a copy.

Regards Dave.
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Thank you Dave & Alan, for  your  write up on the  weekend  at Beechworth  and photos, well done, 
made me  feel enviuous I could not be there.   Lola R.

Glad you enjoyed it Lola.
Seems many people did in fact.
I should however point out that all I did was offer the cyberspace to a friend.
Keep an eye out for more of Alan's work here at 1880.

Regards Dave.

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Hi Dave,
your site is one of a kind. I have just started learning about this story as I am originally from New Zealand.
I have been on your pages for hours tonight and am still reading. I just wanted to thank you for putting
all this information on the internet for us to read for free. I have book-marked it and will be back soon.

Cheers Blain.

Hello Blain,
great to hear from you and that you enjoyed your visit.
NZ has a connection too via the story of the killer 'Sullivan' who murdered in NZ.
Ned questioned a man named Sullivan at Glenrowan thinking perhaps he could be the killer.

Keep reading, Dave.
.....................................................................................................................................................................

hi, i was just wondering if you had any info on Ann Jones in 1880?
like how old she was, what her living conditions were, what has happened in her life leading 
up to the siege etc? it would be great if you could help me on this one,
thanks.

Shayler Conder.

Please see my Ann Jones page.
                             Dave.

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Hi Dave,

I noticed in one of the writtings on your web site that it mentions a person called Sullivan who was a convict.  
I am of Irish descent and was wondering if any Sullivans where around at the time of Ned Kelly?  
Any information would be great.

I find your site to be a great source of information and this how I came across the fact that there was a Sullivan 
at Glenrowan at the time of the seige, if it was not for your site I would not have known, hence the fact I am now 
very curious if I am perhaps of his descent?  It mentions he was a platelayer and was one of the people to help 
rip up the line at Glenrowan.  I look forward to using your site as my children, and they love the games and questions 
on there.  This site is now permantly on my desktop for easy access.  
I am now trying to look further into this Sullivan (PR/R), hopefully I will be able to find some answers.  
In the meantime if you find out anything please let me know.

Cheers

Trish Henderson (nee Sullivan)

Thank you for your messages Trish,
I am searching my archives for extra info on Mr. Sullivan.
He was very fortunate not to be the Sullivan from NZ that 
Ned was looking for. That Sullivan might have been in hot 
water indeed. It is great to find people learning more about
their family via this site.  Bringing these people back to life
is the least we can do.

Regards Dave.

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Hi,
This is Keri, from Griffith University in Brisbane. I've used your site 
(http://www.glenrowan1880.com /jerilderie_bank.htm) for an assignment, 
and I was just wondering how I would reference it seeing as how there is 
no author or year listed on the site. 
It would be great if you could help  me out with that.
Cheers
Keri

Hope the project comes out well, glad to be of some assistance.
Everything unless otherwise stated has been written by me for this site.

Looking forward to seeing the finished product, Regards Dave.

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HUGH BRACKEN.

Hi Dave
 
I have been looking at some of the information you have entered about 
Hugh Bracken and the siege at Glenrowan
 
Hugh married my great great Aunt Amelia Ryder in 1867
I have a photo of them taken about that time, if it is of interest to you
 
I notice you have a photo of Hugh taken after he retired from the Police force
I would like to obtain a copy and one of James Bracken if possible
Please let me know how I can  obtain a copy by e-mail
 
Regards Ken Ryder

Great to make contact Ken,

thanks for the image of Hugh and Amelia!
That is a great photograph never seen before
outside the family.

I will locate the picture believed to be James in his uniform
along with the older Hugh and send them to you.

Thanks again, regards Dave.

....................................................................................................................................

Hi Dave,
Thought you might be interested in this detail as reported in The
Mansfield Independent, Friday, August 25th, I871 .
______________________________ ______________________________ __

Mr McPhail, a farmer at the Black Swamp, has sustained a loss by the
death of his only son, a boy 14 years of age, under peculiarly
distressing circumstances. It would seem that the boy was a witness
against Isaiah Wright for illegally using a horse belonging to Mr
Newland, the postmaster at Mansfield.
He went to Beechworth to give evidence. Just as he was about to return
home he was taken ill with diphtheria, and was compelled to go into
the hospital, where he died on the 18th inst.
______________________________ ______________________________ ________

The young lad who died was Archibald McPhail, my grandfather's only
brother. They were the eldest and youngest of 11 children so my
grandfather never knew him.

Claire

Thanks for the above message Claire,

when you read this along with the information sent in below by Jenny
you really get a feel for the times. Dave.

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MAINDAMPLE PARK STATION

Hi,

I am wondering if you can help me.  I am trying to confirm that the stolen horse which Ned was caught riding, 
and for which he was gaoled, was stolen from Maindample Park Station.  The brother of my g-g-g-grandfather, 
William Highett, held the lease on Maindample Park for many years (along with Thomas Willis)

Regards
Jenny Joyce

Thank you for your query Jenny.
The horse in question was the Mansfield post master's and had been 'borrowed' by Wild Wright.
When he could not find the horse later he borrowed one of the Kelly's horses and said to Ned that he could 
ride his when found before returning and making the exchange. Unfortunately for Ned the horse
was stolen and he was caught riding her by Constable Hall in Greta. Ned received a savage beating and 3 years gaol, 
Wright who actually stole the horse only received 18 months.


John Molony in 'I am Ned Kelly' said:

In March 1871 Isaiah chanced to pass by Maindample Park near Mansfield and then
his eyes happened to fall upon the graceful figure of a white-faced chestnut mare in
a paddock. 

Max Brown in 'Ned Kelly; Australian Son ' said:

The mare was of distinctive appearance having a white blaze and a docked tail. 
Ned found her, rode her into Wangaratta and loaned her to the publican's daughters to 
ride around town; and this, he suggested, was proof enough he had no knowledge Wright
had shaken the mare from the Maindample Park Station."

So it seems Jenny that your ancestor may have indeed had this horse on his property.
(assuming we are talking about the same era)

Regards Dave.

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USS KNOX

Hello Dave,

I came across your site and found a little piece I wrote about the Knox's
crew learning about NED and the how it influenced our repoire with the folks
in Geraldton.

I was in Sydney on Business in July and hope to get back to Australias
again. maybe visit a Ned Kelley spot when wine tasting.

Best Regards and Cheers, Patrick Reardon

Thanks for writing in Patrick!
I had hoped we may hear from you some time.
We may be able to catch up on your next visit, 
regards Dave.

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COULD THIS BE NED'S GUN?

Hi Dave, 

I believe this is may be one of the Kelly pistols, unfortunately the owner who is old I have 
promised to keep secret, his father passed the pistol onto him. 
These photos I took only 2 weeks ago matches exactly photos taken in the 1940’s of the 
same pistol from Glenrowan siege.:

John

Further information:

The left side of pistol has stamped no 320.

The way that stamp on pistol was CROWN on top then R STAR B.

What do our 'gun experts' out there think?
If you look at the gun on page p88 of Ned the exhibition book, 
you see one just like it.  Dave.

........................................................................................................................

(Second e-mail from Amy, is she related to Ned?)

Hi Dave,

These are the only names i have gotten of my mother, im not sure if these
will help.

my great grandfather's name is-
William Francis Kelly
Born:08/01/1905
Died:28/11/1976
Age:71

Great Great Grandfather's name is-
Francis Kelly
Born:30/10/1858
Died:20/12/1942
Age:84

Great Great Great Grandfather's name is-
Francis Kelly
Born:1825
Died:11/08/1874
Age:49

There is also Archiebald Kelly born in 1839 and died in 1909. He married
Agnes mudie.
Do you think we could be related?

Thank you so much.
Amy

Hello again Amy,
I received this reply from Ellen Hollow (Kate Kelly's Great Granddaughter)

No Dave,

The only persons with the Kelly name were John(Red) Kelly's brothers

James (Tipperary Jim never married , often in Goal, he was the one who set fire to the house)

Daniel and Edmund. To the best of our knowledge  never married and nicked off as soon as the trouble started.

All the above plus sisters Anne and Mary arrived in Australia on the Maldon 1857. 

Mary did not marry and Anne married James Ryan.

Bye,

Ellen

(Thanks Ellen)

 Sorry Amy, the answer is that they are not related to Ned's Kelly's.

.........................................................................................................................

Dave.

Here is an opportunity for all interested readers to visit, the  "Old Magistrated Court", 
Cnr. Russell & Latrobe  sts., Melbourne.
See Where Sir Redmond Barry Sentenced NED, maybe even sit in Sir Redmonds chair.
Rod Quantoff, Mary Keneally's Husband   is doing a  one man show there, called
"Tense Courtroom Comedy.  "  Case of the Crown  V  Someone"  in the Audience.
Tickets can be purchased through Ticket master, or at the door.    the show runs from 
 7th. Feb. to  3rd. March.    

Lola (nee Lloyd)

Thanks for alerting us all Lola.

I remember Rod from the Ned Exhibition dinner many years ago.

.......................................................................................................................

Hi Dave,

My name is Amy and i am related to the kelly f.amily through generations back
and i was curious is it true that Ned Kelly was secretly married? and that
she givin' birth to a girl just after Ned was hung?

According to reseach Ned was a father and had gotten married on 25th
September 1880.
Please get back to me with some information on this.

thank you.
Amy
Hello Amy,

Kelly Historian Gary Dean and Dagmar Balcarek have written a book which includes
a chapter about the possibility of Ned having been married.  
However the story you refer to sounds a bit like the fiction Peter Carey wrote in his book.
Gary's book is titled 'Women and Bushrangers' He writes about a lady named Madela, whom
it was believed may have been married to Ned. There is a police report about that possibility too.
There is also an obscure newspaper 'letter to the editor' where a lady stated that she was Ned's
wife. Personally I doubt very much Ned ever married.
You can contact Gary at http://www.nedkellysworld.com.au (to get his book or ask a question)

You could also read a lengthy article at another site: http://www.bailup.com/historyMarriage.htm
This may answer some of your questions.

Dave.

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Dear Dave,

do you know if the Siege dinner will be held in 2007?
I remember meeting you at the dinner in 2003, it was a time of fine food and fine company.
Glenrowan is THE Kelly town and your webpage is THE Kelly site.

Cheers Renata Perone.

Thanks for writing in Renata,
after the cancellation of the 2006 dinner I am not sure what the future holds 
for the annual dinners.
The fact that they are no longer held at the siege site has previously put me off 
going. However I might give them another try in 2007 if one is held.
I hope I was friendly when we met, I do recall those early dinners with fond memories.
Glenrowan the town has such potential, all it needs is direction.
Glad you like 1880.

Regards Dave.

.................................................................................................................

Dave, reading through your article on the  armour, in  paragraph XXVI  
I see you  say the  suits of armour were stored in the stables at the Police 
Stud Depot  in Bundoora, I  would like  to  disapprove that statement.  
Our family lived  there and  played there  for  quite a few years before 
moving to the Broadmeadows Police Depot, it  was not  stored there.  
BUT at the St.Kilda rd. Depot  the  armour was stored above the stables . 

Lola (nee LLOYD)

Hello Lola, thanks for bringing that to my attention.
I am unable at the moment to recall where I found that part.
It will try to look into it soon. It was many years ago that I wrote that article.
It must have been fun playing in such an environment as a kid.:)

Dave.

.............................................................................................................................................................

Have been reading about the pistol auction  with some interest and was just 
curious as to whether the pistol sold. Noticed it in the Sydney Morning Herald 
but have not been able to find any further information.
 
Regards
Robert Taylor

 Hello Robert,
at the present time we have no idea how the auction went.
Stay tuned. Dave.

............................................................................................................................

Dave, thank you for giving us all a place to air our thoughts and
opinions regarding the Fitzpatrick revolver that is on auction. Even
if the newspaper does not use any of our info for whatever reason, at
least we have it here in full for any interested parties.
In answer to Mr. Thompson's rebuttal to the findings of myself and my
friend, let me first say that "my friend", Brian Stevenson, is a
librarian with the State Library of Queensland, Far North Queensland
Collection, and that he has appeared on (and came in as first runner
up during the championships) the Einstein Factor televison show with
the topic of expertise "The life and times of Ned Kelly." That said, I
will say that neither of us knows where Fitzpatrick's gun is today,
just like so many of the other relics, no one knows! Also when Mr.
Thompson refers to his website where he talks about the gun, let it be
known that we were answering regarding the statements made in the
article from the Sydney Morning Herald dated Oct. 4 that clearly
intimates it was Fitzpatrick's gun lost after the second shot was
fired. His website only came to our attention later where he seemed to
hedge his bets and put things a bit a differently per his rebuttal.

As far as the police rushing the house and breaking eggs and causing
disruptions and terrorizing the girls well it seems that would be
partly that, a terror tactic to try and draw out the gang to
retaliate, even Ellen surmised as much. (Also in my earlier narrative
I had mentioned about a couple of times the were police searching for
the bullet holes in the bark at the hut and for guns BUT the guns that
were used by the parties involved in the April 15 fracas).

Firstly from the Jerilderie letter--

I enquired after my brother Dan and found him digging on Bullock Creek
heard how the Police used to be blowing that they would not ask me to
stand they would shoot me first and then cry surrender and how they
used to rush into the house upset all the milk dishes break tins of
eggs empty the flour out of bags onto the ground and even the meat out
of the cask and destroy all provisions and shove the girls in front of
them into the rooms like dogs so as if anyone was there they would
shoot the girls first but they knew well I was not there....


Then from Cookson--

But the old woman had many tales of what she called the persecution by
the police to tell. Her daughters had been, she said, subjected to
continued and studied indignities. Police would come at all hours of
the night to search the house; and they would pull the girls out of
bed and turn their beds upside down in the most rough and brutal
fashion. "The girls could have told more about those things than I
can," she said wearily. "They had to suffer. And it was the conduct of
the police all through - the brutal ill-usage that we had from them -
that made all the trouble. I don't know much of what happened after
Fitzpatrick came that day. But the things that the girls have told me
the police used to do were simply brutal and without excuse at all. If
they had of been trying to provoke the boys to break the law and
retaliate they could not have done more than they did, and I firmly
believe they were trying."


As for not mentioning Kate, we  were not debating about Kate Kelly's
importance to the story or to the Kelly family (though some would say
that many of the things her sister Maggie Kelly Skillion had done were
attributed to Kate at times), we were debating only the facts about
the purported lost revolver, which we stand by as in our original
narrative where all said the gun was returned to Fitzpatrick and
produced in court.
Sincerely, Sharon Hollingsworth

You are welcome to share your thoughts here Sharon.
For that matter so is anyone with an opinion on this, be it either side of the debate.
I am trying my best to stay neutral and just give the reasonings of others.
Dave.

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Dear Dave,

Below I have my responses to Tom Thompson's earlier comments at this
site regarding the Kate Kelly pistol.

[Tom Thompson wrote]
Thanks for your interest in generating responses on matters mutual. I am
aware of the items offered up by Sharon Hollingsworth & friend and sent
by her to the SMH.Interestingly they make no mention of the numerous
times post the Fitzpatrick incident that the police upended the
household, including knocking over all cooking utensils etc, searching
for - what? If Fitzpatrick didn't lose his weapon, why were the police
so persistent in continuing to search the house?

[my reply] We actually did mention the police visits to the Kelly home.
These were, according to Ned in the famous Jerilderie letter, aimed at
harassing the female inhabitants, not searching for weapons.

[T. wrote] Fitzpatrick was drunk and loses his gun - searches are made -
submissions are made - including Fitzpatrick's that he did lose it.

[my reply] Please provide contemporary evidence from Fitzpatrick that he
did permanently relinquish possession of it- as opposed to lost it and
had it returned - during the fracas of 15 April 1878. This will prove an
interesting contrast to his depositions (quoted in the Chiltern
newspaper of 25 May 1878) and the later display of the revolver at the
trial of Mrs Kelly.

[T. wrote] A "revolver" is produced during the trial. Wow - with what we
do know about the Victorian Police, Ms Hollingsworth prefers to believe
that the unsubstantiated revolver brought to trialAFTER the event
(and never seen since) PROVES he didn't lose it!


[my reply] Sorry, but if something can be produced, then it is not lost.
The idea of Fitzpatrick producing anything but his own revolver when his
superiors, or an alert legal person were in the position to pounce on
such substitution in an instant is pretty thin. Why not just say that
the Kellys kept it?

[T. wrote] Wheras the last thing the Victorian Police would like to have
made public was that their Lawman was drunk and disabled, and lost his
weapon to a bunch of Irish gals!

[my reply] Fitzpatrick never said that he had been disarmed by the Kelly
women, but more to the point, nor did anyone else. By the way,
Fitzpatrick's employment was on very thin ice before 15 April 1878, and
he was fired from the force shortly afterwards. By his own admission, he
was a liar and a larrikin and never did his duty. The police force had
no reason to protect Fitzpatrick.
Incidentally, at the time when the revolver was produced in court, the
Kellys had not killed three police at Stringybark Creek, and there was
nothing to indicate that these minor local nuisances would be discussed
so fervently over 125 years later.

[T. wrote]That's like thinking Frank Clune was a historianwhen he was
an accountant, and had to use a ghost writer.

[my reply] Can't argue with this one, except the comparison is lost to
me.

[T. wrote] I remind all that what was actually stated and is on the
website: "be it the fated Fitzpatrick weapon or one of the many
appropriated by the Kellys during the Outbreak, (this) helps reclaim her
story."

[my reply] This looks like an admission that Mr Thompson is not sure
that the weapon in his possession has anything to do with Fitzpatrick.

[T. wrote] My interest regarding this relic is to "reflect on her role
in history" wheras some of your forum seem determined to undermine her
very position. For example, there is nothing in Sharon Hollingsworth's
"evidence" to show where Fitzpatrick's gun IS, nor any interest in
offering the very substantial facts that Kate Kelly indeed had a
revolver from about 15 years of age. In fact, there is no mention of
Kate Kelly at all. This is typical of so-called Kelly research.

[my reply] Sharon Hollingsworth and I don't need to have any knowledge
of where Fitzpatrick's gun is to know that the weapon in Mr Thompson's
possession was not retained by the Kellys after the fracas of 15 April
1878. That is just as logical as saying that I need to know exactly
where Elvis Presley is if I say that I don't think that John Howard is
Elvis in disguise.
In 40 years of studying the Kellys I have never seen any contemporary
source stating that Kate Kelly owned a weapon during the period of the
Kelly Outbreak.

[T. wrote] Considering the drama and gutting of any Kelly relic-site, I
am surprised at anyone demanding the site be known "publicly" - although
I have made it clear that it is from one of Kate Kelly's actual homes in
the Forbes district. This is to protect the site. However, may I be
clear, it is unequivacly a Kelly-Forster only location.

[my reply] No one has questioned where  it was stored, just that it has
any connection with Fitzpatrick.

[T. wrote] Also I have made it clear that the revolver was stored in
lard, and wrapped in strips of leather, and located within a wall
cavity. As Ellen Hollow has noted (but perhaps has not seen the
newspaper article) "I would have thought it would have to have been
buried, primarily for the safety of her children"

[my reply] No one has questioned how it was stored, just that it has any
connection with Fitzpatrick.

[T. wrote] I believeEllen is correct. Kate Kelly was married in
Forbes, with child, and became known as "Ada Foster" in November 1888.
From 1885 she had buried her name; but now she "buried" her revolver
within the house. While Ellen Hollow says "IF Kate had a gun" the
reality of her public exhibitions from 1880 clearly identifies her as
presenting Kelly Relics. Indeed the Sydney Morning Herald call the first
event The Kate Kelly Exhibition.

[my reply] This sounds as if Mr Thompson has a reference from the Sydney
Morning Herald describing Kate's display as The Kate Kelly Exhibition,
and that it mentions revolvers, as opposed to plain old relics . Please
share the reference with us.

[T. wrote] While newspaper reports from 1879 to 1881 show Kate Kelly
having or exhibiting Kelly revolvers, I am interested that researchers
who have shownno interestin Kate Kelly, and have failed to locate
either the Fitzpatrick or Kate Kelly revolvers. They seem keen to
dismiss Kate Kelly's role in the entire Kelly saga.

[my reply] OK, sounds as if Mr Thompson has unearthed some newspaper
reports showing Kate as having or exhibiting revolvers. So the
references should be easily followed up if he lets us have them. I do
know that Boxall says that armour and some guns which were used on the
Kelly raids were on exhibit when Kate and Jim did their show but I would
like to see the exact wording in the newspaper reports.

[T. wrote] There is barely a word on her life post 1880,barely a
photograph, yet the oral history from 1879 to the early 1880s like Ye
Sons of Australia - consistentlynote Kate Kelly as being integral to
the Kelly story, and involved with a weapon:

'The daring Kate Kelly how noble her mien
 As she sat on her horse like an Amazon queen,
 She rode through the forest revolver at hand'

[my reply] Couldnt find a date for this one, although it appears on what
seems to be a University of New England website. But if Mr Thompson
chooses to use a ballad as a reliable historical source, he obviously
also believes that Ned was felled by a shot from a trooper (not Sergeant
Steele), that Euroa was their first rush or exploit (although the bank
raid here took place six weeks after Stringybark Creek) and that Dan
Kelly was killed by a single ball (because of the state of his and the
other gang member, Steve Hart's bodies when they were retrieved, no
cause of death could be established, take your pick between shot by
police, themselves, or each other in a suicide pact, poison, or overcome
by smoke and burned.)

[T. wrote] Well that is what they sang from Beechworth to Forbes. One
wonders,as I survey this clamour to attack, instead of procure
further information offered, as being evidence of the Kelly Saga for
some as a Boys Own Story, instead a family saga, one that precludes Kate
Kelly and her Furious Riding, Riding Astride; being shot up while
procuring ammunition or food,her partin nurturing family while her
mother was in prison; of hertrying to saveDan at Glenrowan, of
trying to save Ned from the noose, or trying to keep her family alive
post this total calamity. And then trying to make something of herself.


[my reply] It was actually Maggie Kelly, the sister about six years
older than Kate, who performed some of the specific actions one of
which was trying to stop police from setting fire to the hotel at
Glenrowan.

[T. wrote] Yes Dave, Kate Kelly did have a revolver, it was found in her
house, and she has inscribed it. Some of your informants would prefer
that Kate Kelly's story doesn't exist - which is why there is so little
to deal with; and why www.katekelly.biz will be a quiet research program
aimed at informing others about her own engagement with the Kelly saga.


[my reply] Finally, a point of agreement. While I don't know anyone who
would prefer, or has reason to prefer, that Kate's story does not exist,
I wish Mr Thompson well in his project, and look forward to the
unearthing of more information.

Brian Stevenson

Thanks for this long reply Brian.
It is obvious you have done your homework on this subject.
I have learned a few new things myself over this story.
Regards Dave.

..................................................................................................................................

Hi Dave,Crikey!Tom Thomson's sure got everyone's attention.A pistol found in a house 
occupied by Ned's sister Kate that was taken from constable Fitzpatrick during the confrontation 
in the Kelly hut that ultimately ignited  the Kelly Legend?It's almost as important as the two holy 
grails of the Kelly story, the Republic of N.E.Victoria, and Ned's birth certificate.Will Tom ever 
produce 100% evidence that this is in fact "THAT" weapon?Will "WE" ever produce the evidence 
that will prove this is not the weapon?Ned stated in his letters the police would rush into the house 
and upset all the milk dishes,no gun, break tins of eggs,no gun, empty flour out of the bags,no gun, 
even the meat out of the cask,no gun, destroy all of these children's provisions,no gun,shove these 
young girls into a room like dogs and if any one was there shoot the girls first,but still no gun.The 
next heroic deed the police would commit would be to poison the dam of these young siblings who 
had committed no crime,ultimately killing their cow and horses to stop their brother from watering 
his horse---but still no gun.The police weren't looking for this so called gun, but were there to harass 
the only thing that they could strike back at Ned Kelly , with hopes to bring him out into the open.
Is this THE GUN,if so Mr Thomson it belongs to Australia for all to see,not to go to auction to the 
highest bidder and to the private collection of some foreign millionaire.I have heard such an item 
would fetch $400,000 at auction,can you not see why we are skeptical of this item?$400,000 for the 
price of a family's tragedy?If you can prove without a doubt this was the weapon used on that fateful 
evening then so be it, but to me it's just another item going under the auctioneer's hammer for monitory
gain.

Alan Crichton

Hello Alan,
an entertaining way of putting it.:)
I wonder a bit re the price-tag after seeing how low the Joe Byrne pistol went at auction.
If it were to be proven to be Kate's/Fitzpatrick's, then would not the Government stop it
from being exported under The Protection of Movable Cultural Heritage Act 1986 as they 
did Ned's shouldercap? (assuming a rich foreigner wanted it)
As for the gun belonging to all, I guess that is a debate for another time Alan.
Dave.

 

...................................................................................................................................

Hello Dave,
This saga does continue.
 
As the auction is tomorrow it is now in the lap of the gods to wait for the result. However, I cannot let this latest 
letter go without a response.
 
I was under the impression Mr Thompson was offering a pistol alleged to have been issued to Alexander Fitzpatrick 
by the Victoria Police in the 1870's,which  was alleged to have been found during the recent demolition of a house in 
Forbes. His response has been very defensive, yet he offers no actual proof  that gun belonged to Fitzpatrick or that 
the alleged find was indeed the house Kate lived in.
 
If the price tag reported in the news paper was not so exorbitant, and there had been a willingness to be more open 
with details of the discovery, including who found the gun, when it was found and the location of the find, perhaps he 
would have received a more sympathetic hearing.
 
Sharon Hollingsworth and Brian Stevenson are thorough and careful researchers. They have offered a sound case as 
to why this pistol may not be that belonging to Fitzpatrick.
 
I have attached a photo of Kate and Bill Foster's house taken late in the 1890's, I wonder how it could stand until the 
alleged recent demolition.
 
Regards,
Ellen Hollow

Thank you for your input Ellen,
your words are of great value in this current debate.
The image of the above house demonstrates you have the intimate knowledge 
required to get to the bottom of this story. Dave.

 

..............................................................................................................................

Hello, Dave.
My name is Lee Dean and I grew up in the Forbes, Parkes, Condobolin areas.
My earliest childhood memories are of visiting Kittie Kelly and Ben Halls graves.
Over the past decades, I always find the time to visit their resting places and pay my respects.
This brings me to my questions..What happened to Alexander Fitzpatrick after he was dissmissed
from the Victorian police force?. What did he do with the rest of his life, how did he die and where
was he buried?
Hope this isn't too big a challenge for you and I appreciate any information on the matter you
may be able to furnish.
Warmest Regards,
Lee Dean.

Hello Lee,
I have never been to Forbes but wish to some day.
Alexander was thrown out of the police force whilst serving at Lancefield. 
He was actually a popular policeman among many of that town and a petition 
was signed by many to save him from being sacked. (available at archives Vic)


Fitzpatrick was transferred out of Benalla soon after the incident at
the Kelly home in 1878 and bounced from post to post over the next year. 
For a few months in 1879 he was a patient in the Police hospital,  later that
year he was assigned duties in Lancefield. That would be his last police 
assignment, he would be dishonorably discharged in 1880. He then moved to 
Hawthorn and became a "traveller" (travelling salesman).
He had married Anna Savage in 1878 and they had 3 children. He gave
testimony before the Royal Commission in 1881. In 1911 he was
interviewed by B.W. Cookson for his "Kelly Gang From Within" newspaper
series. He died May 6, 1924 at age 67 or 68 of "cirrhois of the liver and
then cardiac arrest" and is buried in Box Hill Cemetery.

Also you may be interested in the following from the Victoria Police Achives;

Date of birth: 18.2.1856
Place of Birth: Victoria
Appointed: 20.4.1877
Date of leaving force: 27.4.1880
Reason: Discharged.
Rank on leaving: Constable.

His 'calling' was a Boundry Rider.

Hope that helps, Dave.

......................................................................................................................................................

Dear Dave

 

Thanks for your interest in generating responses on matters mutual. I am aware of the items offered up by Sharon Hollingsworth 
& friend and sent by her to the SMH.  Interestingly they make no mention of the numerous times post the Fitzpatrick incident 
that the police upended the household, including knocking over all cooking utensils etc, searching for - what? If Fitzpatrick didn't 
lose his weapon, why were the police so persistent in continuing to search the house? Fitzpatrick was drunk and loses his gun - 
searches are made - submissions are made - including Fitzpatrick's that he did lose it. A "revolver" is produced during the trial. 
Wow - with what we do know about the Victorian Police, Ms Hollingsworth prefers to believe that the unsubstantiated revolver 
brought to trial AFTER the event (and never seen since) PROVES he didn't lose it! Wheras the last thing the Victorian Police 
would like to have made public was that their Lawman was drunk and disabled, and lost his weapon to a bunch of Irish gals! 
That's like thinking Frank Clune was a historian when was an accountant, and had to use a ghost writer.
 

I remind all that what was actually stated and is on the website: "be it the fated Fitzpatrick weapon or one of the many appropriated 
by the Kellys during the Outbreak, (this) helps reclaim her story."
 

My interest regarding this relic is to "reflect on her role in history" wheras some of your forum seem determined to undermine her 
very position. For example, there is nothing in Sharon Hollingsworth's "evidence" to show where Fitzpatrick's gun IS, nor any interest 
in offering the very substantial facts that Kate Kelly indeed had a revolver from about 15 years of age. In fact, there is no mention of 
Kate Kelly at all. This is typical of so-called Kelly research.
 

Considering the drama and gutting of any Kelly relic-site, I am surprised at anyone demanding the site be known "publicly" - although 
I have made it clear that it is from one of Kate Kelly's actual homes in the Forbes district. This is to protect the site. However, may I 
be clear, it is unequivacly a Kelly-Forster only location.
 

Also I have made it clear that the revolver was stored in lard, and wrapped in strips of leather, and located within a wall cavity. 
As Ellen Hollow has noted (but perhaps has not seen the newspaper article) "I would have thought it would have to have been 
buried, primarily for the safety of her children"
 

I believe Ellen is correct. Kate Kelly was married in Forbes, with child, and became known as "Ada Foster" in November 1888. 
From 1885 she had buried her name; but now she "buried" her revolver within the house. While Ellen Hollow says "IF Kate had 
a gun" the reality of her public exhibitions from 1880 clearly identifies her as presenting Kelly Relics. Indeed the Sydney Morning 
Herald call the first event The Kate Kelly Exhibition.
 

While newspaper reports from 1879 to 1881show Kate Kelly having or exhibiting Kelly revolvers, I am interested that researchers 
who have shown no interest in Kate Kelly, and have failed to locate either the Fitzpatrick or Kate Kelly revolvers. They seem keen  
to dismiss Kate Kelly's role in the entire Kelly saga.
 

There is barely a word on her life post 1880, barely a photograph, yet the oral history from 1879 to the early 1880s like Ye Sons 
of Australia - consistently note Kate Kelly as being integral to the Kelly story, and involved with a weapon:
 

'The daring Kate Kelly how noble her mien
  As she sat on her horse like an Amazon queen,
  She rode through the forest revolver at hand' 

Well that is what they sang from Beechworth to Forbes. One wonders,  as I survey this clamour to attack, instead of procure 
further information offered, as being evidence of the Kelly Saga for some as a Boys Own Story, instead a family saga, one that 
precludes Kate Kelly and her Furious Riding, Riding Astride; of being shot up while procuring ammunition or food, her part in  
nurturing family while her mother was in prison; of her trying to save Dan at Glenrowan, of trying to save Ned from the noose, 
or trying to keep her family alive post this total calamity. And then trying to make something of herself.
 

Yes Dave, Kate Kelly did have a revolver, it was found in her house, and she has inscribed it. Some of your informants would prefer 
that Kate Kelly's story doesn't exist - which is why there is so little to deal with; and why www.katekelly.biz will be a quiet research 
program aimed at informing others about her own engagement with the Kelly saga.
 

Tom Thompson

Publisher

................................................................................................................................

Hi Dave,,just to let you know book sales are steady,but the great news is, I've had three 
schools contact me regarding a presentation of my book to year 7 students,reading some 
of the verse and a discussion on the Kelly story.Dakabin primary wanted it as their third 
term book,but there is no way I can put together a decent audio visual presentation in such 
a short time,so it looks like it will be after Christmas holidays.I am more excited about 
talking to the kids on the Kelly story than selling books.This was the whole idea of doing 
the book.Bruce Mercer's grandson took his book to school and all the kids have gone Ned 
crazy.They all went to the Pioneer Museum the other day, and everything they saw, they 
wanted to know if Ned Kelly had one.So mate it's all starting to happen.This could be the 
start of a new career for me.Once I get enough books sold,all I have left to do is to buy Kate's 
Cottage and I'll be content.Well mate, thanks again for your support and hope all is well with 
you and your family.
Cheers
Alan

Well done Alan,
now that's the sort of career I could handle!
Keep us informed of your progress.
Dave.

.......................................................................................................................

Hi, Dave, as promised here is the documentation that Brian Stevenson
and I have worked up as we attempted to disprove the legitimacy of Tom
Thompson's claims that the gun he has up for auction on November 5th
is the one that Constable Fitzpatrick "lost" during his visit to the
Kelly homestead on 15 April 1878. We sent all of this material to the
Sydney Morning Herald reporter who did the original story and he says
he will possibly use some of this in an article coming next week.
I wanted to go on and give the info in full here for your readers'
consideration. I hope everyone can take a few minutes and bear with me
as I present the evidence that can maybe convince them that this gun
is not of the provenance which Mr. Thompson says it is................
..................................................................................................................
..................................................................................................................

Hi Dave,

on your (wonderful and informative) site, you have the following:


George was in Melbourne for treatment for his eyes when he wrote this letter.

Source of the above: http://www.geocities.com /Heartland/8267/GeorgeMetcalf .htm



I am writing to let you know that this website is no longer available, I took it 'off air' a few 
months back. So if anyone wants any info on George Metcalf  (George Metcalf was born at 
Fingal in Tasmania in 1846, his father being a convict by the name of Robert Metcalf.)or his 
family, I can be contacted at:



regards,

Leone

Leone Fabre

Medical Genealogist
Royal Melbourne Hospital
Grattan Street
PARKVILLE     VIC 3050
Australia
Hello Leone,
thank you for alerting us to the changes.
I visited the link just now and it was working, however I guess not for much longer
so I downloaded all the family information from there. It is great to read about George
and his father who was a convict. It brings to life a person who was an important
part of the siege and where most are just names we know nothing more about, George
we can follow to the hospital and unfortunately read about his death not long after.
He remains one of my favourite persons from the Inn and thanks to your information
is very much alive in the story that is Glenrowan.

I created an image file for your e-mail address which hopefully will stop spiders
etc causing you to have a ton of spam at work.

Thanks again, regards Dave.

ps, now if only I could work out if the 'White's' you have are related to me.:)

...........................................................................................................................

'Dear Dave

Hello, I hope this finds you well.  I am a PhD Student at Monash Uni in
Melbourne, looking to explore heritage tourism in rural / regional
areas. I have chosen NEV as the case study site for my research, because
of my love of the region, but mainly due to its rich landscape of
cultural heritage, which is of immense significance to Victoria and
Australia as a whole.  I have particular interest in Ned Kelly due to my
Irish background, and would like to explore how his and the Glenrowan
'story' is preserved and used.

I have found your 1880 website incredibly useful for the purpose of my
research - such a great resource encapsulating information across the
board from so many sources - research, documentation, comments, media,
events, etc.  For that I thank you sincerely, you've aided my background
research a great deal.

Regards Fiona.

Hello and thanks Fiona.
Good to know the 1880 site was of some assistance to you in your work.

Also great to hear that someone is working on a project such as yours.
The North East is a wonderful part of Victoria, if only the powers that be 
can learn not to destroy our heritage as they have done
in Glenrowan. 

I offer what assistance I can and wish you good luck with your PHD.

Regards Dave.

.........................................................................................................................................

Dave, I am writing to you concerning that article you have posted on
your site regarding the pistol that was allegedly "stolen" from
Constable Fitzpatrick on 15 April 1878 and which was found in the
remains of one of Kate Kelly's old homes.
Brian Stevenson (the Einstein Factor finalist whose area of expertise
was The Life and Times of Ned Kelly) and I have gotten together and
worked out what seems to be a solution to this mystery and we have 
found evidence that it could not possibly be Fitzpatrick's revolver 
being offered for auction.
Earlier this week we contacted the reporter who broke the original
story and we hope he can use our research to show the public that 
what is being presented is not as it seems. In case he cannot use 
any of our material (or just uses part), I do hope we can come back 
here and present all in full (and do so well before the auction 
deadline).
Sincerely, Sharon Hollingsworth

Well done with your research!
It seems there could be more to this story still to come.
I look forward to reading the newspaper article if they do in fact publish it.
Please keep us informed, regards Dave.

...................................................................

I am hugely sceptical about the authenticity of this item.  
 
What Tom Thompson is offering for sale is alledegedly a police issue pistol from the 1870's. 
 
A pistol that some one has scratched KK on the handle. 
This pistol  was allegedly found in NSW, in an unspecified location, allegedly in the area where 
Kate lived. 
 
I concede that there was a Kelly shot gun with KK on the butt and that is common knowledge, 
any one could carve KK on the said pistol
.  However, apart from the carving of those letters,  
there is no sound evidence offered to link this pistol to either Fitzpatrick or the Kelly's.
IF Kate had the gun, IF it had been found at the Condoblin location. I would have thought it would 
have to have been buried, primarily for safety from the children.  
  
Tom Thompson claims it was found when a recent demolition took place. However,  as the 
location was not specified, it may have been found in any of the places she had worked or 
stayed over the five or so years she was up in NSW, prior to her  marriage . 
I have a photo 
of the shack they lived in with two of Kate's children near by, and I can tell you it was no better 
than a chook shed and it would not have needed demolition, the wind would have long ago 
done that! 
 
Regards,
Ellen Hollow

Thanks Ellen, always good to hear your opinion on such matters.
I was especially interested in your comments about the condition of the house.
Dave.

...................................................................

Dave it is  quite amazing how  all of a sudden  a pistol has been found identified  as  from 
Kate Kelly ?????
a piece of armour  identified  as  from a  piece of Joe Byrnes Armour ???? Earlier the horns  
done as Scrimshaw, by George King ????
Wonder what will be next the   papers on the Republic of North East Victoria. ?????

Lola  R.

Hello Lola,
it seems there are several persons wondering about this item.
The armour looks convincing, but I have not had the opportunity to look closely at it.
The horns, well we know what happened there don't we.
If the papers turn up that will be a sight to see!
Dave.

...............................................................................................................................................

Dear Dave You may have seen the Age article re Kate Kelly's 
revolver going up for auction. Currently I am building a little 
site www.katekelly.biz to both show it and reflect on her role 
in the Kelly saga. As this happens a lot of contacts come to me. 
If the cottage has not yet been sold, perhaps I might put a link 
to your pages? Let me know Regards Tom Thompson (Publisher)

Hello Tom,

yes I have seen the article and uploaded it to my 'newsroom' page.
I must say Tom that I have several reservations about the authenticity of this pistol.
Such reservations often occur with anything being offered for sale connected to Ned Kelly.
I have had several people contact me about it and hopefully they will send in further comments
that others can read in order to make up their own mind about it.

The cottage is still for sale, I will ask the owners if they are interested.
When do you expect the web site to be operational?

Regards Dave.

.....................................................................................................................................

Hi Dave,
 
I only recently happened upon your site and find it quite impressive. I have a keen interest in the 
Kelly Gang and am always on the lookout for new websites or books I haven't read. I'd just like to 
point out to you that it seems you have used Joe Byrne's brother's picture instead of Joe's... 
You can check in Ian Jones' 'The Fatal Friendship' which has pictures of both of them. 
Also I can't remember ever seeing the picture of Ned which you have on the carriage thing on the 
kids' page - it is quite small so a bit hard to tell but it looks strange!
 
Again, well done and keep up the good work!
 
Regards,
(Mrs) Airi Repetti

Thanks Airi, glad you liked 1880.
The picture you refer to of Joe is in fact from a painting/sketch of him.  It was from a book 
I have but I cannot put my hands on it right now sorry. It was more your American Western style 
painting of the Kelly gang. (the carriage one) If you refer to the one on the Joe page, that is from
an artist named Morony. I have used his painting of the gang for my images of Joe & Steve. 

Thanks for dropping by, regards Dave.

..................................................................................................................................................

Dear Sir

I have been to Jerilderia and have spoken to numerous people about Ned. The story I 
got was that him and his family were the opposite religions, one Catholic one Protestant, 
than that of the local police. It was also told to me that the sister was good looking and 
even being of different beliefs the sheriff still wanted sex with her. She was not interested 
in him and this produced a constant harassment of him and his family, mother father, sister, 
and brother, all doing jail time for one reason or another. It was after one encounter between 
the sheriff and the sister where the sheriff was less than professional that Ned decided to take 
his sister honor into his own hands. The sheriff did not like being told to leave his sister alone 
and that is when the sheriff decided to make Ned a criminal. You know the rest of the story and 
I have been to the Melbourne goal and seen the death mask and helmet. I do not know what you 
have heard but this is what I have heard from the people that say they had relatives that knew them. 
Thank you for your time.

Donald B Lehoux 1st.

Thanks for an interesting set of observations Donald. Dave.

.........................................................................................................

Greetings Dave,

just a note to express my appreciation for bringing us your latest research 
on the Glenrowan Blacksmith. 
I have been eagerly awaiting for further updates on your research. 
Very Interesting indeed on what you have bought forward so far, I await with 
anticipation for further updates.

 
Keep up the great work & well done.
 
Truly magnificent.
 
Regards,
Joe Dipisa. 

Thanks Joe,

next week I expect to finally meet the source of this story.
Naturally  I cannot be 100% certain of anything but I can 
assure everyone that the man providing the information is 
trustworthy and he fully believes what he is telling me. 
He did visit the site of his grandfather's Smithy in 1930 and 
it was still standing back then. I am sure we are all asking the 
same questions about the blacksmith, the fact that he took off 
during the night would make him a prime suspect for the police. 
Yet his name does not appear among the suspects. That in itself 
does not in my mind preclude him from being involved.
All I can say is this story is fully believed by the family involved 
and there is definitely truth to it. Finding part of a horseshoe at 
one possible location in Glenrowan was encouraging, however
I would still like to obtain further evidence if possible.

Dave.

..............................................................................................................................

Dear Dave,
I have just been looking at your excellent site on the Kelly history.  
I have an interest in the Aaron Sherritt side of the story as his wife Ellen 
was my grandmother's sister. 
All the accounts of Aaron's death mention his wife was in the hut at the time 
of the shooting but offer no further information. 
Would you, by chance, know anymore of what happened after Aaron's death  
(to his wife or mother-in-law) or could you tell me where I might best do some 
investigating. There is a story in our family that young Ellen was pregnant at 
the time but that might just be family "gossip".  

Thanks very much for any assistance you may provide.

 

Regards,

Prue Beck

Thank you Prue for your comments & query.
The info you seek is on its way shortly.
Yes Ellen was pregnant at the time of the shooting of Aaron.
Ellen received a 'special allowance for the loss of her husband'
of one pound a week from the Government.
On 22 December 1880 Ellen made a claim for part of the reward.
If anyone has detailed information of what became of Ellen
(who remarried, a Murphy and had a couple of kids)
please send in for Prue.

Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hi Dave.

I think you've got everyone waiting for the outcome of that illusive blacksmith, 
but I was wondering if you had any information on John Stanistreet .
He seemed to have disappeared after Glenrowan.
Did he stay with the railways, and where did he go? Are their any relatives out 
there who might throw some light on this famous stationmaster.
Was he interviewed at the Commission?

Hope you can help mate

 

Cheers Alan

Hello Alan,
I am still awaiting a reply from my contact about the blacksmith.
I will ring him soon and as I will be driving past his town in a few weeks I 
am hoping he is willing to allow me to scan the man's photograph.
I am also looking into the possibility that the bellows and other tools
still exist in his care.

As for Stanistreet, I had to look at Corfield's book to find this:

P 451, he remained in Glenrowan and died 30 Nov 1896 at Bendigo.

I am not sure when he arrived in Bendigo Alan.

As for The Royal Commission, Gary Dean has a doc which included
Mrs Stanistreet
. Click here.  (Second Progress Report I believe)

Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hi i was wondering is it true that till this day you are still unsure that ned or his brother was shot?? 

I would really like toknow please e-mail me back.....

Karen Bulte

Hello Karen,

I am sure that Ned was shot and Dan died at Glenrowan,

Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hello Dave,

 
I am a great admirer of your site.  
However, the inclusion in your Newsroom of Sophie Mirabella's political rant begs a comment or two.
 
Cannot we be spared this boring piece of ideological diatribe?  It had little to do with Ned, but a lot to 
do with Mirabella's fixation on Julia Gillard.
 
Does anyone really think that Ned himself would have ever had the time of day for Ms. Mirabella?  
Ned made it clear in his short time that he stood for the oppressed and the common folk.  Mirabella 
and her colleagues have made it legislatively clear that they stand for the rights of employers to do 
whatsoever they care, no matter the unfairness that may result.
 
So who is really the hypocrite, Sophie?  Go and attach yourself to some other cause, but leave Ned's 
story and name to those who have shown they care about what he stood for and believed.
 
With no offence and a sweet good-bye,
 
Trev A.
 
p.s. Dave, I hope you will give my opinion the same due as you gave Ms. Mirabella's. 
 I have only written to you once before, with no mention of politics, but you never posted 
my thoughts.  Best wishes, Trev.

Hello Trev,

in my opinion the news article was worth uploading. 
Especially at this time as Sophie is involved in sorting out what has happened 
with the Glenrowan Revitalisation.

She has had a lot to do with the Kelly story, she was the person fighting hardest to keep
Ned's shouldercap in Australia. She has been involved in the siege dinners and lots more
to do with Ned and Glenrowan. (As Federal minister) If not for people like her we might 
not have the full suit of Ned's armour.  

Whether or not Ned would have had time for politics I have no idea, mind you he is said
to have been involved in the attempted Republic.

In writing what you have you have actually increased the politics of this one news item.

If Ms. Mirabella wanted to write in to me I would be happy to post her comments (as I am
anyones), however I doubt that she will be interested.

At least in this country we can speak freely, and I can upload whatever I wish.

Dave White.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hi Dave,

 I already sent a message to the other email address that is on your site 
but I decided to try this one as well.

I'm doing a major work for extension history on the differing perspectives 
of Ned Kelly. I have found many Australian perspectives that praise him 
however (and I know they are out there) I need negative perspectives towards 
him, perspectives held by people of Irish descent and people of English descent. 
Do you think you'd be able to help me here? If you could shed some light onto 
some of the opinions, evidence that those opinions exist (e.g quotes) or even 
websites that deal with those opinions I'd be delighted. 

Thank you very much, you're help will be acknowledged in my project.

Kindest regards,

Ashleigh Dollin

 

Hello Ashleigh,
you sure have selected a tough topic.
I hope that I can help you here, I can think of negatives myself 
but will have to look up quotable references.
When do you need this by? Have you asked elsewhere?
Breaking it down between Irish/English may be a little difficult.
Let me know how much time I have and I will see what I can do.
Kind regards Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hello,

I am unsure of where I should start...but I am REALLY hoping you can 
help with some information.

My father, who died in 1975, always told me that we were related to 
Stephen Hart of the Kelly gang. Since my father has been gone so 
long, and there are no other relatives I can ask who might know, I 
have decided to contact you (I just know where to begin in the 
geneology stakes!!)

My great grandparents (I think that is the relationship) are Patrick 
(b.1837 - 91) and Sarah Hart (b.1837-1934)
- they lived in the 
Trentham district (I think) and possibly moved around a little as 
Patrick was a farmer (so i believe).

It was belief understanding that Steve was either a great great uncle 
to me or a cousin of some sort. I am very unclear on this information 
and what the connection is, but I also have a VERY vague memory of 
there being a photo of Steve in a family photo album. ( I may be 
wrong as it is a VERY long time since i have seen the particular album).

Patrick and Sarah Hart had a dinner set fashioned in wood from the 
east Trentham forest (which is why I am assuming pat and Sarah lived 
in this area). The set was split up after their deaths and the chairs 
were found many years later at a primary school in Trentham by my 
father or grandfather. The legs had been cut short so as to suit 
small children.

My father passed the chair on to me and always told me that Steve 
Hart probably sat at the chair one day. I still have the chair.

Though I am even unsure as to my connection to Patrick and Sarah, I 
do know my grandparents are Sir Mortimer McCarthy and lady Linda 
McCarthy (nee Stuart). My father was Frank McCarthy.

The reason i have details of Patrick and Sarah is because my father 
was smart enough to place the history of the chair on the base of it, 
so it would never be lost.

I would like to find out, as my son who is now 8 years old, has taken 
some interest in the Kelly Gang because of this possible connection, 
and because of the "special chair". As the chair has been passed down 
the line of our family, I would like to see it continue to my son.

Cheers, Tina (Caitriona) McCarthy

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Thank you for your enquiry Tina.
I will be passing this on to a descendent of the Hart family.
If anyone else would like to assist Tina, please write to me and I 
shall pass it on to her.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hi again Dave,

                         Just got back to Brissy after a weeks holiday in your beautiful state.Kicked off for a few days in Yarra Glen and then headed off to Ballarat and to Sovereign Hill.Crikey ,talk about cold,I thought it  was actually snowing at Sovereign Hill until I saw the snow machines on top of the buildings.What a fantastic place, I would love to see something similar near Glenrowan.The next day we were standing in front of the Kelly house at Beveridge,what a sorry sight,to see an important part of our heritage in such disrepair brought a tear to my eyes,let's hope the current owner keeps to his promise and gets it back to something near its former glory.On the Saturday we were Glenrowan bound,and our first stop is always to say G'day to Neil at Buffalo Mountain Wines and to pick up supplies,read him a poem titled "Edward"and scored myself a bottle of Ned Kelly vintage port,I think he wants to use it on a C.D he is putting together.Next was to have a wander through the Siege Site,

Sorry Wangaratta council,but you've really stuffed up big time,when you took away the earth you must have taken the vibes with it.The dug up concrete left in a heap, and the flagged off muddied ground also left a tear in my eyes,not like Beveridge for what they haven't done, but in this case,for what they have,I felt like having a good slug,not just at the council,but out of my good ol' bottle of Ned Kelly port. 

 

The next stop was the Billy Tea Room in Glenrowan for the Sympathiser's Reunion at 6.00p.m.Forget the flashy annual dinner for 85 bucks at Baileys,Gary Dean had organized Eureka Smith for our entertainment,singing all the songs from his great C.D."Blood On The Ground ",Neil dropped in with a couple of bottles of port[for medicinal purposes only] and Linda from the Tea Room supplied us with unlimited scones, cake, sausage rolls, tea and coffee etc. etc. Gary, who has been crook all week ,staggered from his sick bed to give his presentation,now that's showing the old Kelly spirit,and through recent research,it looks like Ned had a lot more relatives in the north east than what was first thought. Thanks to Eureka I had a chance to read one of my poems,and talking to some of the local shop owners through the evening,they could be looking at running their own celebrations e.g.annual dinner and other events.So all up mate we had a great time,and many thanks go to the friendly people of Glenrowan.Hope to catch up soon.

 

Alan Crichton

 

Edward               by A.D.Crichton

 

Not every man was born a king to rule this troubled earth,

Yet men from poor and lower class can rule through inner worth,

A worth, and strength, that can’t be bought, with gold nor precious things,

Their treasure lies within their hearts, and minds, to make them kings.

 

No crown or robe they need to wear, to lead a kingdom’s might,

Just equal justice for all men, for this they’ll surely fight,

To stand against corrupted laws of government and police,

For love of family and their homes, and right to live in peace.

 

But men of worth are only men, of blood, and flesh, and bone,

Not gods or saints all void of sin, just men who stand alone,

And sometimes life’s events can change the course of these lone men,

For right or wrong, just one will rule, and to their judgement send.

 

My dear young friend, we know your name, we know your story well,

We know the reasons for your crimes, in letters you did tell,

So rest in peace, Australian Son, beneath your countries earth,

Your legend lives, you stand alone, you showed your inner worth.

Alan.

Alan, thanks for the poem and info on the Glenrowan weekend. Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

Maz.

Dave, the photos of glenrowan were beatuiful im jealous 
how erri would that feel because it looked erri.    maz 
Glad you liked it Maz.
Hi Dave, what magic, almost eerie scenes indeed, like time has stood still.
What must it have been like for those boys and those frightened souls 126 years ago . 
They say a picture says a thousand words . It looks like  the ghosts of Glenrowan seem 
to be reaching out.
Great stuff
Alan
 
Thanks Alan.

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Ann Jones's brother?  May 4 2006.

Hi Dave,
Thanks for the book plug, I hope you like it when released. 
I was having a look through the "Argus" when I came across a statement from Anne Jones, 
stating that " they" had killed her brother and done away with them. 
I believe that she also had a photo of Kennedy at her home and had also stayed at his house 
at some time. Do you know much about Kennedy's family, and could there be any truth in 
what she says?. Have attached newspaper report for your perusal.
 
 
Cheers, Alan

Hello Alan,

not sure what that article was referring to. According to Cookson Kennedy was
the surname of Ann's father who was the first white man in the Bucklands. 
I had heard that Ann had a photo of Kennedy the Sgt, but not that she had stayed
with him.

Regards Dave. 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

How many shot marks on the armour? May 3 2006

Dave, love the site etc etc. I've read that Ned's Armour had 25 bullet dents in it, 
including nine in the back. What is the amount, if any, of bullet marks in the others?
Regards Greg.

Hello Greg, thanks for sending your query.

If you asked me about Ned's armour I could answer very easily having Carrington's
sketches. However your desire to know about the other suits is a bit more difficult to
answer. Despite having seen the suits many many times, I cannot say I ever counted 
the 'dents'. Looking at photos I have it is a bit hard to tell which is a 'dent' caused by 
a bullet and which was caused by the blacksmith's work.

If you live in Melbourne you could visit the police museum and see Dan  & Steve's
actual suits. Perhaps you could see the 'dents' for yourself. Despite having a load of info
about the armour I do not recall seeing mention of how many bullets hit the armour. 
(apart from Ned's)

Should I find an answer I will let you know. Dave.

p.s. As a side issue, I recently had an interview with an elderly gent who tells an 
interesting story about how his ancestor made Ned's suit of armour in Glenrowan
and then shot through. I hope to have permission to use his name and story soon.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

A cemetery in town? May 1 2006.

Can you tell me if there is a cemetary in Glenrowan?  Rosie. 

No Rosie, there is no cemetery in Glenrowan. 

You could try Wangaratta or Benalla perhaps.

Who are you looking for?

Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hello from SA.......May 2 2006.

Hello webmaster Dave,

your site goes gangbusters there.
I am trying to build a site for my family tree findings and I dont know how you
do it because I cant.  I found a ancestor who I think was in the pub at
Glenrowan. I found the name in your list of names, thanks for your efforts.

Cheers & beers Charlie Colgate South Australia.

Thanks Charlie,
I am no webmaster mate. I am just someone with a passion who spends far
too many hours sitting here when I should be elsewhere.
I take it your ancestor was not a Colgate? What was their surname?
I served in the army with a Colgate, we never seemed to know each others
christian names. :) Regards Dave.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Message from Maz ............April 30 2006.

MAGNIFICENT:

every time I go to your site it just looks better & better I love it              maz

 

Thanks Maz, always great to hear from you, Dave.
(Maz got married at Kate's Cottage Glenrowan)

........................................................................................................................................................

Poetry Book on the way April 22 2006.


Hi Dave,

              Saw the new site format, don't mind the black, but I really loved the green, it reminded me of the beautiful country down there, and got me in the mood.Any way, I thought I would let you know I should have a book published by November titled "Bound For Judgement / An Outlaw's Story in Verse".I couldn't find a lot of verse on the Kelly saga, so I thought I'd write the story in verse.Each verse is a story in itself.I have left all mention of names and places from the verse, and put in a brief explanation of the story at the end of each verse.I thought that the story could apply to millions of people throughout the world who have been forced into actions they would not normally take.I thought it would be a good little book for students from year 8 to 12.and to also encourage them to read the books and find out what the story is all about.Contents:The Beginning/Homeward/The Hero/Home/The Teacher/Behind Bars/A Change Of Trade/Scuffle At The Bootmakers/The Unicorn/A Fatal Encounter/River Bound/The Holdup/Across The Border/The Charge Of Justice/The Caves/Plough shares Bold/Outlaw Bait/The Party/A Good Fight/Farewell/A Day in Court/Peace at Last.As soon as it's out , I'll send you a copy.

P.S don't forget to give me your thoughts on Ned's birth date in the feedback,oh, and by the way, the book is illustrated by Marilyn Stahmer.

Cheers

Alan Crichton

 

Hello again Alan,

I am sure a lot of people got used to the green but with the upgrade came the stronger black.
I have seen many of your poems and look forward to seeing this complete work soon.
Ned's birth date, now there is a touchy subject!  Regards Dave.

 

..........................................................................................................................................................

Fairdinkum................March 26 2006.

Hey there..love your website...so big...will take a while to get through it....
 
I was researching the old pentridge in victoria....being a guest there for a bit on and off..
Like 'terry Wilson'..I heard the rope snap tight round ronnies kneck
http://www.glenrowan1880.com/oct_to_apr.htm
 
I run a website or two...and I'd like to link you....
 
www.fairbloodydinkum.com
www.littleozzybloke.com
 
Take care..phill - littleozzybloke

G'day Phill,
good to see some more 'Aussie' sites mate.
Link away all you like. That feedback was some time back that you refer to,
Terry was an interesting chap.
My site is big, no doubt about that. Seems some people dislike that fact, 
they are free to find a five page site to visit. For me the bigger the better.
However I have removed several pages of 'other Kelly towns' for now to 
make room for planned new pages. With so many pages navigation is a 
challenge, however this latest incarnation of 1880 should be easier to 
follow.

Dave. 

.......................................................................................................................................................................

Last Outlaw Mini Series.........24 March 2006.

Hello!  I am looking for some info on the Ned Kelly mini series, "The 
Last Outlaw"...  You've probably seen it, so could I please ask you a 
question?  I'm thinking of purchasing some Australiana/historical DVDs 
for my kids - and I'm wondering - is there any foul language (sh#t, 
bloody, Jesus Christ, etc.) or any nudity/sex in this?

Thanks for your time...

Allan
The mini series 'The Last Outlaw' is suitable for 
kids in my opinion.
It does not contain any strong violence nor nudity. 
Compared to the recent movie it is very tame indeed. 
It reminded me of the old westerns in a way where they 
get shot and hold their stomachs but you see little
blood. Dave.

.................................................................................................................................

Info sought re Police Uniforms....16 March 2006.

Hi there I'm having a bit of difficulty in finding 
detailed information on the Uniforms worn by the 
Police involved in the Kelly saga, I was wondering 
if you could help? 

Thanks for any info or contact info Glenn

Hello Glenn, it might be worth your while to contact the Victoria Police
Museum here in Melbourne. 

They are very helpful in there and have lots of info and images etc.
It is worth remembering that during much of the Kelly chase police wore plain
clothes.  Regards Dave.

Question about Steve Hart's birth date.......14 Mar 2006

Dear Glenrowan 1880,
 
Firstly, I'd like to say that you website is great. It's clear and easy-to-read and very 
professional. Keep up the good work.
 
I have just one criticism - the category of "The Kelly Gang" states that Steve Hart 
was born in 1860, when it has been historically recorded that he was born in 1859. 
Perhaps he was baptized in 1860? As he died when he was 21 years of age, in 
1880, chances are that he was born in 1859. He was actually TWO years older than 
Dan Kelly, meaning that all of the Kelly Gang were two years apart in age terms.
 
Thanks again and good job on the website!
 
Yours sincerely,
 
Caitlin Darrell

Hello Caitlin,

if you look a little closer you will see that I have in fact used the year 1859 myself.
It was given to me by a reader of 1880 named Lisa who has a copy of Steve's baptismal 
certificate. 
She said that 1859 was written as the year of his birth according to the certificate. 
Prior to this I had used 1860 myself as it is what most say. However today on my site where 
there is mention of 1860 it is from quotes of books I reproduced for readers including the
Royal Commission and Charles White.

Glad you enjoy visiting the site, regards Dave. 

ps, if I do in fact have 1860 somewhere else under my text I will have it fixed. :) 

...........................................................................................................................................

Query from the State Museum.....8 Mar 2006......

Dear Mr White,
 
I am writing to enquiry whether you might be able to provide me with the date 
on which the article 'Dowsett Fights Kelly' appeared in the Albury Banner in 1880, 
published on your website at the below URL:
 
http://www.glenrowan1880.com/dowsett.htm
 
The refernce to Dowsett being issued Colt breach-loading revolvers by Victoria 
Railways is of interest, and I would like to follow it up.
 
With regards,
Benjamin
 
 
Benjamin Thomas
Assistant Curator, Arms
History and Technology Department
Museum Victoria
GPO Box 666E, Melbourne, 3001, Australia
bthomas@museum.vic.gov.au

The date in question was July 3 1880 page 8 and yes he does
say the Railways issued that pistol. I look forward to hearing the 
results of your research.

Regards Dave.

...........................................................................................................................

Request from Beechworth website.....7 Mar 2006..........

Dear Glenrowan1880.com Webmaster
 
I came across your www.glenrowan1880.com site today and thought it 
was an informative guide to the Glenrowan region. I noticed you link 
to Beechworth as a place of interest and thought our web site may be 
of interest to you and your web site visitors.

Beechworth.com.au is the most comprehensive and up-to-date online 
resource currently representing Beechworth and surrounding districts. 
It provides invaluable information for visitors and residents alike and, 
by its design and content, encourages people to discover the entire region. 
Our Ned Kelly page also includes a link to your www.glenrowan1880.com.

I wonder if you would be interested in updating your link to 
Beechworth.com.au. If you have any questions about our site, please 
feel free to contact me directly via return e-mail or phone at xxxxx.

 Thank you for your time.

 Jamie Horne

Webmaster
www.beechworth.com.au 

Link added as per request.

............................................................................................................................

A couple of poems, Ned Kelly & Bail Up by Terry Knights. 

Hi, I'm sending you these two poems that I wrote that you might be intereseted in?

They are in a collection of unpublished poetry that I've written over the years in my 
book titled "The Window To My Soul"

If you'd like tyo put them on your website for others to see & read, I'm only too happy 
for you to have them.

Regards, 

Terry Knights

The Legend of Ned Kelly


It all began in ’78, for Ned and brother Dan
The Legend of Ned Kelly, and the Kelly gang
It was in the township, of Greta, very small
With the shooting of a trap, and a warrant for them all

They holed up in the mountains, beyond Mansfield town
Ready for a siege, against the officers of the crown
They had with them two friends, Joe Byrne and Steve Hart
Who had ridden with the Kelly’s, from the very start

There was a massive hunt, for the capture of them all
Which lasted two long years, and ended in the fall
A mile from the Kelly’s, camped at Stringy bark Creek
The traps waited in ambush, upon a mountain peak

But the gang surprised them, killed three in the fight
And so was declared outlaws, upon that very night
They robbed many banks, in daylight very bold
Relieved them of their cash, and many sacks of gold

The traps they had an ally, Aaron Sherritt, was his name
He gave the Kelly’s up, for their rewards, he could claim
So in June of ’80, their supplies had all run out
Capture wasn’t far away, for that they had no doubt

For Ned and Joe Byrne, Glenrowan was their plan
For them it was to be, what was their final stand
Close to the station, they had taken the local Inn
For this their final fight, a fight they planned to win

But unknowing to the Kelly’s, the traps were forewarned
And so fought a bloody battle, until the early dawn
In the heat of fighting, they set the Inn alight
Burnt it to the ground, with only Ned in sight

In his suit of armour, Ned Kelly faced the lot
They fired long, they fired hard, into his legs they shot
And in the Melbourne Gaol, Ned Kelly they did hang
For that it marked the end, of Ned Kelly and his gang.

Written by…..Terry R. Knights.
Copyright © 1997
( I wrote this poem after reading The Ned Kelly story in a 
1955-56 car magazine )

.............................
.Bail Up

It was well past midnight, we sat near froze
Soaked to our skins, through to our toes
We’d the devils own work, upon this night
No comfort the rain, no moon to light

Just the two of us, my cove and I
To rob the Queen’s mail, it’ll pass us nigh
Now here the coach be, in no great rush
Along the old road, the Bargo Brush

‘Bail Up’, I shouted out
My intentions be known, left little doubt
The driver reigned up, near died of fright
As we came along side, our revolvers in sight

‘Bail Up’ ‘I say, can’t you hear’?
I turned to my cove, and said, ‘You take the rear’
‘Come on now driver, hand over that mail’
‘Or I’ll shoot you down, of that I’ll go bail’

‘Ay all you gentlemen, in the coach, step down’
‘Hand over your watches, your jewels and crown’
Keep nothing back, if you value your lives’
‘Come step lively, and you’ll see your wives’

Most had sovereigns, cheques and gold
Other’s pound notes, in their large billfold
We’d taken every shilling, every guinea worth
Apoligised to them all, for the accident of birth

‘Get aboard now gentlemen, our business is done’
‘Be on your way, ‘fore the rising of the sun’
The driver gathered up, the reigns in his hand
Took off at a shot, we watched where we stand

The lanterns of the coach, could be seen no more
We waited awhile longer, as to be quite sure
Then I laughed to my cove, ‘This night we’d a ball’
‘Our bags near full, actually quite a haul’

‘We must put seat to saddle, if we want to get away’
‘And leave no trail, for the traps this day’
We lathered our roans, along the track
As they’d be after us, every man jack

Back to the Hollow, with the jewels and cash

In the Nulla Mountains, our own secret stash
For there we’d be safe, no other land
‘Till we again ventured out,and try our hand.

Written by…..Terry R. Knights.
Copyright © 1997 Terry R. Knights.
( I wrote this poem after reading the book 
“Robbery Under Arms”, 
I didn’t find out about Tom Roberts painting 
‘Bailed Up’ 1895-1927 until a teacher showed me his painting )

Great works Terry, I hope you have penned some more since '97.
Thanks again, regards Dave. 

ps, these poems were almost lost amongst the tons of spam I receive
daily and despite being received on March 6th were only uploaded May 2.
Apologies to Terry for the delay.

............................................................................................................................................

Message from State politician Bill Sykes.....1 Mar 2006

Dear Dave, Very interesting - I wish that I had more time 
to brush up on my local Kelly history. 

Regards, Bill Sykes Bill Sykes MP, State Member for Benalla

Thanks for the comments Mr. Sykes.

................................................................................................................................

Deaths at Glenrowan......28 Feb 2006............

Greetings,

So how many cilvians were killed at this last stand?
Thank you,
Michael

Hello Michael,

there were no civilian deaths during the actual siege as such.

However there were four deaths related to the siege.

Martin Cherry died just after being removed from the burning inn &
John Jones died in hospital soon after being admitted.

Much later George Metcalf died from his injuries, so did Jane Jones.

Regards Dave.

.........................................................................................................

Delaney as a maker of the armour? 26 Feb 2006......

Hi Dave

I saw in the topic about who made the armour the name Delaney
was mentioned.  I was interested to know where this information
came from as my mother had told me that she had heard it was a
Delaney but always thought that it was just bragging on this persons
part - who was himself a Delaney. 

I'm from Western Australia and I was wondering if the information
had come from the same place.

I'd appreciate any information.

Regards 

Stephanie

Hello Stephanie,
the information I used came from the archives documents.

"I learned that a suspicion rested 
on Pat Delaney, blacksmith, of Greta, 
and Chas Culph, blacksmith of Oxley, 
the former because he was an intimate 
friend and could be relied upon by the 
head of the gang (Ned Kelly), and the latter....."

Police statements name several persons considered as 
candidates for making the armour. Delaney was one of
those suspected.  

There were several blacksmiths involved and I am at 
present trying to convince an old chap to reveal his family
name as one of those blacksmiths.

Regards Dave.

.....................................................

Nice work champ! (22 Feb)

G'day Champ,

bloody good site you got there. Looks like you have done a hell of
a lot of reading and writing. I cannot find your 'shop' anywhere, can
you direct me please.

I did not realise that there was so much about Ned to learn! I am really
absorbed now and trying to get my hands on all books and newspaper
articles. It appears I am not alone in this quest either.

Cheers and good wishes, Jeff James Taralgon. 

Hello Jeff,
thanks for sending me this message.
Yes there has been much work involved, these days I have slowed
down a but though. I do not have a shop on this site as it is very much
a non commercial venture. However I may soon be selling many of
my Kelly books (here on 1880) as I have several editions of each and 
no real reason to hang onto them. Maybe one of these will be of use to
you Jeff.

Regards Dave.

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Help sought re Shelton family (10 Feb)

Hello Dave,

are there any descendents left from that man saved by Ned when he

fell in the river?

Cheers, Tom James.

Hello Tom,

yes indeed there are plenty of descendents of Richard Shelton.
Richard was saved by a young Ned at Avenel after he (Richard) a 
boy also, fell into the Hughes Creek. Ned saved him and was awarded
the green silk sash he wore at Glenrowan. 

Richard's descendents include Bill Shelton who owns the Avenel pub and
Bluey Shelton the footballer. Until recently two of Richards sons were
still living!

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Help wanted on Steele family (20 Jan)

Dear Dave,
 
Thank you, for your response to my inquiry.
 
Re: Sergeant Arthur Steele
 
I am looking for members of Arthur Steele's family currently in Australia. 
I would like to exchange information with them. Or any one who may have 
information concerning the family of Arthur Loftus Maule Steele.
 
Arthur married and had the following children:
Arthur L. M. Steele, Laurence St. George Steele, Maude Mary Steele, 
Edith Jane Steele, Archabald Gordon Steele, Murray Stewart Steele, 
Ruth Dora Steele and Florence Johanna Steele.
 
I am told all the children were married and most had children. 
However I have not been able to locate or find a contact. 
I am will to exchange information regarding the Steele family.
 
I would appreciate if you could make a posting on your websit and 
forward any inquries to me.
 
Thank you,
R. Steele

Anyone that can assist should write to me and I will pass on
the relevant details. Dave.

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Help wanted on Hart Family (18 Jan)

looking to locate a paternal grandmother  or information about this 
lady her last know address
 
was wondering whether she was related to steve hart in any way 
or if there is a family tree  from the hart family so i can try and 
piece together some history
 
Regards Fiona Burke

Fiona, I have sent your message to Paul O'Keefe
who should be able to assist. Dave.

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A few questions from a lad in New Zealand (17 Jan)

 

Hi Dave,
 
My name is Jarrod Dagg I have being studing the Kelly gang for four years now and 
have being uses your site and have found heaps more facts. I just wanting to know if 
you know where Ned,Jim,and Dan went to school and I wanted to know if you have 
more or any informattion about neds family ( like his DAD, MUM, BROTHERS or 
SISTERS and really wanting to know if Ned, Dan, Jim, Steve and Joe ethir got 
married.THANKYOU. your website is one the of the best.
 
* information wanting to know
 
* birth, deaths, marriges
*Schools went to
* who's armour was the heviest
* Did Ned get any rewards for saving the drowning kid
*PICTURES
 
regards
JARROD DAGG   
thankyou  

Thanks for writing in Jarrod, the new pages I have just 
uploaded may be of some help. Dave.

(Jarrod is 12 and lives in NZ)

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The did you know section (1 Jan 2006)

Hi Dave,
Just having one of my regular browses through your site of which I am a big fan ,
and came across your "Did You Know" section. The only part I was not aware of 
was Wright's brother trying to warn McIntyre not to go to Stringybark or he would 
be shot. I would appreciate if you could tell me from what source this information 
came from as it is very interesting. Love your site and love the town.
Regards
Alan Crichton

Hello Alan and thanks.

From memory, I found that information in McIntyre's manuscript held at the State Library of Victoria. He mentioned that he had been warned not to go. 
Pity he did not heed the grim warning! 

Glad you like 1880 and Glenrowan, might see if I can add some more snippets in that section to try and stump you.

Regards Dave.

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An armourer mate of Ned's..... (Dec 13 2005)...............

My great great grandfather,Seth Brook was one of 
ned kelly,s trusted blacksmiths.I dont know weather 
he made any of the the armour but apparently  he 
had some good stories to tell.My side of the family 
doesnt know much because we were separated by distance,
but the town of beaudesert in queensland is were most 
of his desendant's live and apparently they know some 
of these stories and it could be a real boon for 
historian's,just a hunch!If your interested I could 
find more info from me mum etc. and get back to you.
Thanx    
   Jean Ranyell

Thank you for that Jean.
I hope that you are able to find out some further details!
Anything new we can learn is of great interest to us.
It is perfect timing that you should write as I am currently 
awaiting permission to run a story of a man from Glenrowan
who is said to have created Ned's armour and then shot through.
All of these 'new' stories help us to put together the jigsaw of
history about the Kelly Gang.

Thanks again and please keep in touch.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

An interesting e-mail from NZ re Sgt Kennedy (Dec 7)

Hello,

I do not know if it is of interest to you, but hope that perhaps it will be.  

Today an old fellow I did a job for showed me a page that was taken 
from an old diary, its hard to read the old script,but I made a few brief 
notes, as I believe its of interest/related to Ned.Kelley.

The page is written by Sergeant Michael.Kennedy. and dated between 
11.-25 March 1876 Reg.#2009,with district ect.

Anyway he has written many entries on his daily duties. I understand he 
was killed by the Kelley-gang some two years later ?

Kind regards from New Zealand ,

John.

 

Thank you John for this.

It certainly is of interest!

I am sure many would like to read this page if possible.
Yes, unfortunately Kennedy was killed at Stringy Bark Creek.

Looking forward to possibly seeing the old page.

Regards Dave.  

ps, it has been brought to my attention by Sharon Hollingsworth that this diary
may have been the one listed in a recent Christie's Auction.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

From the Benalla & District Historical Society, Webmaster (Dec 6) 

Dear David, Thank you for your comments on our web site www.benallamuseum.org back in August I think! Your site looks very interesting and I have only had a quick look at it so far. Sorry for the very deayed response! Brian Chandler Webmaster, Benalla and District historical Society

Thank you Brian for your comments.

Getting feedback can at times be like pulling teeth! 

Not to worry, your site is a welcome addition to the wonderful setup at Benalla. Always worth a visit.

I have added your site to my links page also.

Regards Dave.

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Feedback from a new site visitor Nov 23 2005.

g day david your web site is amazing, a real tribute to your efforts,

i am in the motor trade and i visit car sites, club sites, restorations 

histories etc, but they dont hold a candle to your work.

theres too much to take in ,in one sitting i will revisit later

as you know stacks of books have been written about ned

have you thought about doing one?

regards bob leonard

 

Thanks Bob,

great to hear from you!
I hope you do find some time to look around, there is a lot to take in and it will require lots of visits.:) I am no master webmaster, but what I lack in 'bells & whistles' I make up for in content.

As for the book about Ned, every man and his dog has done that however a book about Glenrowan is a different kettle of fish.:)  Then again there are not all that many accurate Kelly books out there, you just never know.

Fit 1880 in with the car sites when you have time Bob, Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Was Ned in New Zealand? Nov 11 2005

Hello, Have just found your site and thought I would drop you an email. Have never been a huge Kelly follower, but we have just returned from New Zealand, and have an interesting theory to put to you. We were visiting a cheese factory (can't think of the name of it) between Christchurch and Akaroa. I do not even recall how the conversation got started, but the man working there was quite adamant that although not many people were aware of it (and especially Australians), Ned Kelly's brother was hung in his place and Ned Kelly escaped (with police help) to the southern island of New Zealand where he settled and had a family before dying in old age. This man had family relations who had known him as did several people in the area (according to him). He also claimed that there were still descendents living in the area today. A week or so later, we were in another town, and had a discussion with another New Zealander who was familiar with the story, but not sure whether it was true. Have you heard of this before? What do you think? The man who told us was probably in his late 50s, early 60s, and said he did not originally believe it, but did research in the area etc. and was quite genuine in his belief that it was true. Regards, Yvonne Walker.

Hello Yvonne and thanks for your e-mail.
This theory has been doing the rounds a lot of late.
I am not sure why they persist when the facts are very
clear. Ned was not in New Zealand and it certainly was 
he who went to the gallows, no one took his place.
I wonder which brother was supposed to have sacrificed
himself? Jim lived until 1946 and Dan perished at Glenrowan.
According to visitors to Bruce's 'Kelly forum' there is a sign
on the South Island stating Ned had visited there.
There may well be some confusion with the connection of 
a man named Sullivan who was a murderer in New Zealand
and a man of the same name was confronted by Ned at Glenrowan. 

I hope this has helped answer the query for you, regards Dave.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Name that tune! Nov 2 2005

Sir: My mum visited the Kelly tourist attraction; She was quite taken 
by a song about Ned Kelly sung by a lady; she can't get it out of her 
head. Do you know the song? Do you have  the lyrics?

 

John Harris

Hello John,

could it be Lazy Harry that has been playing at Kate's Cottage
for 20 years? May be you were at Dad & Dave's Billy Tea Rooms
or in Gary's shop where he has Eureka playing. 
The fact that you ask re 'Tourist attraction' makes me think 
Bob Hemple's animated theatre may have a new tune.
We shall get to the bottom of this.

Dave. (John has replied and is soon to provide more accurate
info)

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

A search for the Glenrowan of old....(12 Oct).........

 

Hi dave,
 
Your site is great but i could use a little more help!!!
As a child I lived in Glenrowan with my grandparents who
used to run a roadhouse coming into the township on the
left hand side!  Im alot older now and have kids of my own
and my son is studying ned kelly, when we lived in Glenrowan 
we used to live in kate kelly"s house which was
located next 
to the roadhose and had statues of ned and kate out the front 
& i am trying to locate a photo of this house so dylan can show 
his teacher & class...
I have asked my grandfather who said he has some somewhere 
but has no idea where they are and Im wondering if you or someone 
could help me
 
Regard
 
Leanne

Hello Leanne,

I am sure I can help with some pics I have.

Maybe someone has some pics that have these buildings in them?
I need to do some checking, the roadhouse is still there, (assuming I am thinking of the right one) but not used as a roadhouse any more. In fact there is no petrol to be had anywhere in Glenrowan these days. Last time I was there someone in fact asked if they could buy that building. A statue of Kate! Never seen that one myself.
Good luck to your son in his studies on Ned.

Stay tuned, regards Dave.


You can just see the old roadhouse here in this cropped image.

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A BLAST FROM THE PAST, SOME OLDER COMMENTS.....................

 

Information Plus! (Dec 31 2003)

 

Dear Dave
 
I am sure Ned would be proud to have his name associated with your site. 
Many people will learn lots and will appreciate the facts rather than the fiction 
many authors cloud their story with.  Hoping lots more info. comes your way in 2004.
 
Best regards
Loretta McPherson, Director
Farmers' Arms Hotel Museum
25 Kirkland Avenue
Euroa 3666
"Ned Kelly Country"

Loretta McPherson 

Thank you Loretta,
it is very special to me to receive such praise from someone in your 
position at the Museum in Euroa, being right in 'Ned Kelly Country'!
Regards Dave.

...................................................................................................................................................

Well Done! (29 Nov 2003) I Am Ned Kelly

Well done. It still remains to the 'experts' to sort out the truth from fiction
but this is the best start I have seen.

John Molony.

Such high praise from someone at the top of their profession.  
Thanks John, 
I hope that the finish is as good as the start. Dave. 

(Professor John Molony, author of 'I am Ned Kelly' is currently visiting
Fellow, Australian Dictionary of Biography, at the Australian National
University.)

.................................................................................

Such is Life. (Apr 16 2004) 

Congratulations Dave on a great site - it is both broad and specific - which
makes for a really good balance. By being broad it gives a good amount of
background with out running the risk of repeating what other sites do - and
by being specific it's got real relevance and meaning by focussing on one
main time point - the siege. The factual/historical information is of great
interest for me as I get my film together "Such Is Life" - and I'll
definitely be going back here to read all I can - particularly witness
accounts. I might be able to find out some more information about Archibald
Andrew McPhee as well - I
think my parents know something - I'll see what I can dig up.
Congratulations on a great site again

Scot McPhie

www.mango-a-gogo.com

Your feedback was most welcome Scot. 
Whilst your film is not set in the time frame of the siege it is certainly of great 
interest to people who follow the 'Kelly' story.
I have often thought long and hard of what must have been going through Ned's 
mind in the last days of his life. Reading his letters written in prison during his final
days gives you some idea what he was thinking. 
I have visited your site and you deserve to be congratulated on your efforts.
I will be keeping an eye on how you progress and wish you well.
I will be interested to hear if Archibald (an eye-witness to the siege), is a relative
of yours. Let's hope that you were can find out more about this railway worker.

Regards Dave White. 

...............................................................................................................................................

A message from New Zealand. (July 21) 

Dave
Points out of 10 -you have already reached somewhere round 9 I reckon.
Great site and EVEN I learned a few new things.
Keep up the good work - if I can be of any help just let me know.
Have started to read new book - and have already picked up some little fibs!
But that's what makes Ned's story such a great one, there's still a lot of
uncovering ( and correction) to do.
Will be keeping a regular eye on you now, though the web, and will touch
base again soon
Cheers
Don

Thank you for your message Don,
I am very happy to see you are still involved in the Kelly story.
I am not sure if I will ever achieve a '10', but I am trying.:)
I reckon I learn something new every day in this story Don.
I hope to for many years to come too.

Regards Dave.

(Don was the author of the 'Bushrangers Scenic Drive' in Benalla What's On 
magazine. He was also the editor of the Benalla Ensign & is now the chief reporter 
for a major New Zealand newspaper.)

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